X-10 500

[MrGrumpy]

IThe 500 motor is not so good IMO, in fact I can't see the point in the 500 - or the SYM 600 come to that. Unnecessary weight, space and thirst for a CVT scooter.

Not sure I agree really. The Bev 350 goes pretty well, though no where near as well as the TMax for example, and of course the Bev is somewhat lighter than the rather hefty X10. It of course depends on what you call unnecessary.... one doesn't need more than 33bhp, but I certainly enjoy having more!

Of course, there is the argument that the X10-500 isn't a big enough step up from the 350 version to be worthwhile, since the 350 engine seems to work pretty well and the 500 engine has only a few more bhp, but I guess you'd have to ride them back to back to make that judgement. An X10-600 sounds like it'd be more fun.......

[Data]

Yes, it's horses for courses. I find the X10 350 vastly underpowered even by my Burgman 400 or Maxsym 400i standards for the sort of work that I do. But it's fine for many other folk. The 350 X10 struggles with a sizeable passenger compared to both the aforementioned machines, on my sort of riding. Not very economical either due to the fact it has to be thrashed all the time if you are covering big distance, and arguably it's not the sort of bike to buy if you are doing bigger distance anyway. Still a nice bike though. But the Max 600i is I believe a winner in every respect and is in my sights. I dropped any thought of the 500 X10 after careful study of the bike and it's spares support (which is improving) but still not so good as Sym's.

[Gerard C]

I've got to join in on this one. Ive just got back from a 1,000 mile blast round Germany to the Eifel region, then onto Luxemburg into Belgium then back into Holland and home. A mixture of twisties like I have never experienced before all the way up to Autobahns. Franks X10 500 - the first in the country - went like a dream. I believe his speedometer is in miles or at least he never said it wasn't. Our top speed recorded was 105mph. We averaged 85mph for hours on the motorways.
I was on my nicely run in Burgman 650 with about 2,000 on the clock - when we set off. The Son was on a K9 Burgman 400. All three bikes performed breathtakingly well. Whenever we stopped the three White - ish Maxis stood out from the crowd.

You really do pay your money and you make your choice. If you like the look of the bike take it on a test ride. If you get from it what you want - BUY it. Maybe you might want to alter pulley weights, maybe you might have to make a cover for a fuse box. Is it such a big thing if the rest of the Bike delivers what you want?

Our three certainly did that. Ask the Motor cyclist on the Autobahn who tried to blow off the three scooters. Ask the stuck up "adventure bikers" on the ferry who could well be stuck in the traffic in Hull for all I know. Traffic we went through like a knife through butter. Make your choice yourself because its going to be your ride.

[spaceprobe]

Correct answer

[Globs]

I find the X10 350 vastly underpowered even by my Burgman 400 or Maxsym 400i standards for the sort of work that I do. But it's fine for many other folk. The 350 X10 struggles with a sizeable passenger compared to both the aforementioned machines, on my sort of riding. Not very economical either due to the fact it has to be thrashed all the time if you are covering big distance,

I'm not so convinced that the X10-350 is so underpowered TBH, I wonder if the one you tried was faulty? Looking at the powers and weights:

* X10-350 is around 33.3hp / 200kg = 166.5 hp/tonne
* Burgman 400 31.5hp / 222kg = 142 hp/tonne
* SYM MaxSym400 35hp / 224kg = 156.25 hp/tonne

so it appears that the X10-350 has the best power to weight ratio of those three. The Xciting 400 might beat it, also of course the Tmax.

I did try a Burgman 400 but compared to my SYM GTS300 it was very sluggish below 60mph, whereas the X10-350 is very much more lively than the GTS300 so my experience appears to back the numbers. Although I'm still limited in power and revs (400 miles into the MCN run-in schedule) it doesn't lack any grunt that I've noticed. The demo X10 had no such restrictions and it felt at least twice as lively as the Burgman I tried and kept on surging ahead from 140kmh on my private test track.

The X10 isn't perfect but so far the only thing I have had to do is use 12" of black duct-tape on the fusebox and buy a decent windscreen. The gearing is fine, the seat space fine, the mirrors work and it's early days but entirely dependable. I've now had to fill it up only twice as the range is superb - 250miles is normal. I'm pretty pleased with how it's going TBH, and with a pillion with ECO on and staying at low torques and limited revs it's still be absolutely fine - if a little too competent.

I realise that the Tmax well be far better than all three - but it does cost about 70% more. Good to hear the MaxSym600 is getting to 71mpg spaceprobe - that's exceptional - my X10's last tank was 75.1mpg with a much smaller engine!

[gn2]

Power to weight ratios look very different when you add the weight of the rider (and passenger if carried)
Then there's the torques.
Bigger cubes usually means more torques.

[Globs]

Power to weight ratios look very different when you add the weight of the rider (and passenger if carried)
Then there's the torques.
Bigger cubes usually means more torques.

Yes but the power to weight is still better on the X10 as it already has nearly a whole bag of sand less to carry.
Then there was my test rides clearing indicating far more push/G force forward on the X10.

* X10-350 32.3 Nm of torque at 6,250 rpm
* Burgman 400 36Nm
* MaxSym 400 35.7

All are affected by gearing of course.

We'll have to find the 0-60 times
Maybe other people have ridden the X10-350 and others and so can tell us what they felt?

[Data]

Yes, Globs. The X10 350 is very good and quite quick too. But your figs are a little out for the 2007+ Burgmans. You are quoting the early model with the smaller engine. Mine is 34ps/33+hp at 7300rpm, and 36.3nm of torque at 5800rpm. Makes a difference when on the road. The X10 I rode had just 800 miles on the clock when I first rode it. It was slow and sluggish throughout but I didn't pay attention to that as I knew it would get quicker with more miles. I then road it again with 2k on the clock. That was an extended ride and it went rather well for a 330cc bike. However, I took it over one of my usual routes I have to follow to the office and it was fun. But...for me it was much too buzzy with the engine revving at 8k revs to maintain my usual speed of 70ish miles per hour (my Burgman is 6750rpm) and with little left in reserve. On the way back with a passenger it was hopelessly underpowered for my type of riding. I had to stick to the left lane as there really wasn't the power to keep up all the time with the faster traffic. Again, my Burgman does it much more easily without any struggle and even steep hills with a passenger don't phase it. But the X10 goes just like I would expect from a 330cc bike. My Burgman has a genuine 400cc engine and and is much faster in every respect and now it has many more thousands of miles on it's clock (the Burgmans take a long long time to finish conforming) it's very fast indeed now for a 400. 0.60 on my machine is around 7.7 seconds. I wouldn't say the Burgman is the best but for me it's pretty darn good. Horses for course etc and not slating the 350 X10. Just saying what I found. You can't really go wrong with the X10 350 it's a good bike but just not for me. Good if you are coming up from a smaller machine when you will notice the power difference. Hope you are loving your Globs. Don't forget to post a nice long road test of it.

[StephenC]

Having moved from 14hp + 150kg 150cc through 21hp + 150kg 250cc to a 28hp + 190kg 300cc, I have to say that for commuting the more powerful of the three is only better in the traffic light grand prix - and I put a lot of that down to the way the gearing and clutch have been set up. Where it does show though, is on the motorway, where the higher gearing needed for less stressful cruising is offset by better torque, resulting in much better acceleration at over 50mph.

So I would agree with others that it depends on what you want to do. An X10-350 (or better still Bev 350) is fine for general commuting but the bigger lump scooters will naturally cruise better at high speed and with a heavy load (no offence meant!).

Horses for courses and all that.

[Ferret]

I agree with that